Spokane Chapter, Reasons To Believe

October, 2004 Newsletter

Table of Contents:

Chapter Meeting: Sunday, October 17, 3-5 P.M.

We invite you to attend our monthly meeting. A presentation is offered to the group, followed by discussion and questions, and we conclude with snacks and a little club business. We always try to start and end our meetings right on time. If you need directions, don’t be afraid to call the phone number below.

  • Date: Sunday, October 17
  • Time: 3-5 P.M.
  • Hosts: Dan and Cathy Bakken
  • Location: 13003 N. Miami Ct, Mead
  • Phone: 466-2693 (for directions, etc.)

Strobel Hosts Show on Pax

Lee Strobel, author of “The Case for a Creator”, “The Case for Faith” and “The Case for Christ”, is hosting an hour-long TV show on PAX called Faith Under Fire. The show airs at 7pm on Saturday nights. The first episode aired on October 9th. Lee will cover some interesting apologetics-type topics! Here’s a quote from the show’s web site:

“Do faith and politics mix? Are there hidden codes in the Bible? When is it moral to wage war? Can we talk to dead people? Is there only one way to God? Does science rule out a Creator? Can reincarnation be proven? What causes religious barbarism? Is God a Republican or Democrat? Why does God allow evil? Does religion subjugate women?”

“No topic is off-limits,” says Strobel. “People feel strongly about these issues, and Faith Under Fire will put various belief systems to the test. People can believe whatever they want, but can they defend it? We’re going to find out.”

For more information visit www.faithunderfire.com

AIG Lists Arguments Young-Earth Creationists Should Not Use

Answers in Genesis (AIG) is a very active young-earth organization led by Ken Ham, an Australian. AIG is taking a positive step toward stopping the use of many spurious arguments for a young earth that are still being circulated widely today, by listing them on their website as arguments that should not be used by young-earth creationists. Here are some of them.

Moon-dust thickness proves a young moon

Young-earth creationists have long circulated a story that NASA expected several feet of moon dust but only found 2 inches, meaning the moon wasn’t around long enough to accumulate all that dust. AIG notes that this was based on faulty estimates of the influx of dust to the moon and can’t be used as proof of a young moon.

Entropy began at the Fall

AIG believes that entropy or disorder (2nd Law of Thermodynamics) is essential to human survival and must have been in effect in the Garden of Eden, and therefore did not begin as a result of Adam’s Fall.

The Speed of light has decreased over time

AIG says it is inadvisable to argue that the speed of light has fallen over time because there are a number of scientific problems with this claim which have not been satisfactorily answered. AIG at this time endorses Dr. Russell Humphrey’s “new cosmology”. Very simply summarized, he believes there is a ‘gravitational time dilation’ around Earth, so that time passes much slowly on Earth than it does in the rest of the universe. To read RTB’s thoughts on Humphrey’s paradigm, visit http://www.reasons.org/resources/ apologetics/unravelling.shtml.

Earth’s axis was vertical before the Fall

AIG says that there is no scriptural or scientific basis for this claim. Genesis 1:14 suggests that there were seasons from the beginning, which would not have been possible if the Earth wasn’t at or near its current tilt.  Also, the current tilt of the Earth is essential for human survival.

Flood waters came from a canopy

AIG says it is inadvisable to teach that Noah’s flood waters came from a canopy of water held in the Earth’s atmosphere. They say this is not a direct teaching of Scripture and   there is no canopy model that provides sufficient water for the Flood.

No rain/rainbows before the Flood

AIG says it is inadvisable to teach that there was no rain or rainbows before the Flood. This is not a direct teaching of Scripture and the Bible doesn’t rule out either rain or rainbows before the Flood.

Human and dinosaur tracks have been found together, proving men and dinosaurs co-existed.

AIG notes that these tracks are controversial, and there is evidence that the supposed human tracks are eroded dinosaur tracks.

Carl Baugh’s creation ‘evidences’.

Here’s a quote from the web site: “Sorry to say, AIG thinks that he’s well meaning but that he unfortunately uses a lot of material that is not sound scientifically. So we advise against relying on any ‘evidence’ he provides, unless supported by creationist organizations with reputations for Biblical and scientific rigor.”

Missing solar neutrinos prove that the sun shines by gravitational collapse, and is proof of a young sun.

This is about a formerly vexing problem – that scientists had only been able to detect one third of the predicted numbers of neutrinos from the sun. Some creationists proposed that the sun was powered one-third by fusion and two-thirds by gravitational collapse. This would have limited the age to far less than 4.5 billion years. However, the ‘missing neutrinos’ have now been discovered, so the sun’s age is consistent with an old earth.

Christian Myths

The article also addresses a number of myths perpetuated in Christian circles by well-meaning but misinformed people.

Darwin recanted on his deathbed.

Here is the quote from the web site, which puts it well! “Many people use this story, originally from a Lady Hope. However, it is almost certainly not true, and there is no corroboration from those who were closest to him, even from Darwin’s wife Emma, who never liked evolutionary ideas. Also, even if true, so what? If Ken Ham recanted Creation, would that disprove it? There is no value to this argument whatever.”

NASA discovered Joshua’s missing day.

AIG says this is a hoax widely circulated on the Internet.

Women have one more rib than men.

AIG has long held this is a fallacy, because if you remove a person’s rib, their children will still have the right number of ribs. There is no genetic ‘pass-down’ of this kind of thing.

Ron Wyatt has found much archaeological proof of the Bible, including Noah’s Ark.

AIG says that Ron Wyatt doesn’t really show evidence, just excuses as to why the evidence is missing.

Rapid Speciation?

Interestingly, the web site holds an admission that evolution works extremely rapidly, in order to explain the fast growth of species after the Flood. The web site says, “rapid speciation is an important part of the creation model. But this speciation is within the ‘kind’, and involves no new genetic information.”

What they mean is that wolves, coyotes and other wild dogs all evolved from one pair on the ark within a few hundred years after the flood (there are historical records of the ‘subtypes’ on earth within that time frame). (Interestingly, further down the web page they say that there is no evidence that microevolution ever occurs!)

Young-earth creationists estimate that there were up to 20,000 species of creatures on the Ark. From that 20,000 species, they believe nearly 7,000,000 species arose. This rapid speciation was triggered by environmental pressure working on small, isolated populations (similar to the evolutionary model of punctuated equilibrium). Also, AIG believes God had given all animals special genetic information that would enable them to develop quickly into variant species. This is inferred from Genesis 1, which says that the ‘kinds’ of animals were to ‘fill the earth’. RTB argues that getting this kind of genetic diversity so quickly is impossible. Animals, especially advanced ones, can’t change so rapidly.

In a paper available online at www.reasons.org/resources/apologetics/other_papers/rapid_post_ flood_speciation.shtml, Greg Moore asks, “If speciation really does operate this fast, why does any line exist at all that is stable enough and distinct enough to be called a species? Why is not the world filled with intermediate forms of every conceivable kind? Why have some species not changed from their ancestors in the fossil record? And why do we not witness thousands of animal species developing from others today?”

The AIG web site also disputes some old-Earth arguments. For example, AIG believes the genealogies in the Bible are strictly father-to-son chronologies, and can be used to date the age of the earth. However, the words for ‘father’ and ‘son’ and ‘begat can actually refer to ‘any male ancestor or descendant’. This explains the differences in the genealogies in different parts of the bible, and makes it clear that more time is involved..

In Conclusion

The AIG web site makes for fascinating reading. It contains examples of critical thinking, and attention to scientific information in many instances.

Many but not all of AIG’s ‘don’t use’ arguments have been summarized here, so to check out the web site, go to www.answersingenesis.org, select the Q&A tab and find “Arguments Creationists Should Not Use.” Or go directly to http://www.answersingenesis.org/home/area/faq/dont_use.asp.

RTB Scholar Appears on the Harvest Show

The Harvest Show, a hour-long daily Christian television program, will have Fuz Rana on its show on October 22.  He will talk about his new book, Origins of Life.

To watch the Harvest show, check out KVBI TV 42, Cable Channel 17, or DirecTV Channel 321 at 6am on Mondays through Fridays.

Harvest TV is probably already getting angry, negative messages from people who disagree with Reason To Believe’s stance on the age of the earth, so we encourage you to send your own, more positive feedback!

How can you help? By visiting their web site, www.harvest-tv.com, and doing any of several things:

  • Click on "reach us" near the top of the screen, and thank them for doing this program.  You might also include your thoughts about the book, what you think of the Harvest website, and request more programming like this with Hugh, Fuz and RTB.
  • If you came to salvation through the work of Reasons To Believe, click on the left tool bar, "Share a Story" and tell how it happened.  Or, if you have had the chance to lead someone to Christ through the work at RTB, please share it. 
  • Send a regular email to:  harvest@lesea.com

  • If you’d like to thank the Harvest Show in writing or by phone:

The Harvest Show
LeSEA Broadcasting
61300 South Ironwood
South Bend, IN  46614
(574) 291-8200

Seattle Chapter to have booth at Science Teachers Convention

The RTB Puget Sound chapter will have a booth at the National Science Teachers Association’s Northwest Conference in Seattle from November 18-20. This is a great opportunity to provide evidence to the skeptics who teach young minds, as well as Christian science teachers who may not yet know about RTB. They need prayer, financial resources (about $1500), and skilled apologists with a science background to man their booth.

If anyone from this area would be interested in helping them in any way, contact them at

Who We Are and What We Do: Your Local Reasons To Believe Chapter

  • We’re here to answer your questions and help local Christians and churches get more answers about science and the bible issues. 
  • We offer trained apologists and bring in national speakers to speak at local churches and other events to share these exciting discoveries.
  • We build alliances with churches, ministries, and groups to share the Reasons To Believe message.
  • We help Christians overcome their fear of science and equip them to use it as an effective tool in spreading the Gospel.
  • We reach out to skeptics and non-believers with gentleness and respect, encouraging them to evaluate their worldviews.

Contact Information

For more information about the Reasons To Believe Spokane Chapter, contact:

  • Phone: Ray Luse (509) 465-8562
  • Email:
  • Web Page: www.reasons.org/chapters/spokane
  • Newsletter Questions? Cathy Bakken, editor, cgbakken@yahoo.com

Resources To Know About:

Reasons To Believe Website: www.reasons.org. Many useful documents are available, as well as their daily new “reason to believe” from the latest scientific research.

Reasons’ Web Store. Buy the books you read about here! http://store.reasons.org/

Reasons Institute. RTB’s online distance learning program. Take college-level apologetics courses. Contact RTB for information at 626-335-1480. www.reasonsinstitute.com.

Reasons To Believe television show. Thursday mornings, 3:00 A.M. Pacific time on TBN. An archive of recent shows is at www.reasons.org.

Creation Update Web Radio Show. http://www.oneplace.com/ministries/creation_update/Archives.asp.